208. How to Be a Mental Health ADVOCATE feat. Active Minds

Jan 16

listen to this episode:

Today's guests are Alison Malmon and Lauren Cikara of Active Minds, the nation’s leading nonprofit organization promoting mental health awareness and education for young adults. Active Minds has a vibrant network of chapters and award-winning programs at more than 1,000 colleges and universities, K12 schools, workplaces, and communities nationwide. Alison heads the organization as its Founder and Executive Director, while Lauren acts as the VP of School Mental Health.

In this episode, we discuss:

+ The personal tragedy that led to Alison starting Active Minds

+ Why people often struggle to talk about their mental health

+ Ways to open up & connect with others about mental health

+ Mental health struggles that occur on college campuses

+ Advice on how to support a teenager who is struggling with their mental health

+ How to get involved or join a chapter with Active Minds

+ Policies that schools & our government should start implementing on mental health

+ so much more!

Active Minds' Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/active_minds

Mentioned In The Episode…

+ Active Minds

+ A.S.K. program

+ Contact Active Minds

+ Sign up for their newsletter

SHOP GUEST RECOMMENDATIONS: https://amzn.to/3A69GOC

About She Persisted (formerly Nevertheless, She Persisted)

After a year and a half of intensive treatment for severe depression and anxiety, 18-year-old Sadie recounts her journey by interviewing family members, professionals, and fellow teens to offer self-improvement tips, DBT education, and personal experiences. She Persisted is the reminder that someone else has been there too and your inspiration to live your life worth living.

a note: this is an automated transcription so please ignore any accidental misspellings!

Sadie: , Welcome to She Persisted. I'm your host, Sadie Sutton, a 19 year old from the Bay Area studying psychology at the University of Penn. She Persisted is the Teen Mental Health Podcast made for teenagers by a teen. In each episode, I'll bring you authentic, accessible, and relatable conversations about every aspect of mental wellness.

You can expect evidence-based, teen approved resources, coping skills, including lots of D B T insights and education in. Each piece of content you consume, she persisted, Offers you a safe space to feel validated and understood in your struggle, while encouraging you to take ownership of your journey and build your life worth living.

So let's dive in this week on She persisted.

Alison: we'll wake up in the morning with our throat hurting and you'll tell somebody, oh, my throat hurts, right? Like, that rules off our tongue. in a way that is totally appropriate we, for whatever reason, feel like we need to wait until we have hit rock bottom before we say that about our mental health. next time you're thinking that next time you're having that little struggle, actually answering the question when somebody says, how are you?

It can open up for you the ability to be vulnerable . And you'll find that almost everybody around you is also struggling in some other way.

Hello, hello, you guys, and welcome back to another episode of She Persisted. I am really, really excited for this episode because, This is hitting very close to home. We have Allison Malum on the podcast today. She went to the University of Pennsylvania and that's where she founded Active Minds.

And I have been a member of the Active Minds chapter at Penn. And I'm sure you guys are aware of this, but my mental health journey and she persisted is really, really synonymous with advocacy and activism the mental health world. And so this was a really incredible, cool conversation to have about What large scale mental health advocacy looks like, How we can create communities where people feel heard and included and seen and also bring change to the mental health industry.

So, like I said, Allison Malum is on the podcast and joining her is Lauren Sakara. They are both team members at Active Minds.

Allison is the founder and executive director, and Lauren is the VP of School Mental Health. So we have two really interesting perspectives here. if you aren't familiar with Active Minds, it is the nation's leading non profit organization that promotes mental health. It's Mental Health Awareness and Education for Young Adults.

They have a huge network of chapters and award winning programs at over a thousand colleges, including Penn, K 12 schools, workplaces, and communities. And this is a really powerful episode. We talk about the loss in Allison's personal life that led her to start Active Minds. We talk about why there is such a challenge and struggle with talking about mental health and being vulnerable and being open and what causes that disconnect between knowing that it's good to get support, it's good to lean on others, and then actually taking that step to be vulnerable.

We talk about how you can actually open up and connect with others regarding mental health, common struggles that occur on college campuses. how to support a teen who's struggling with their mental health, how you can get involved or join a chapter of Active Minds, And then big picture policies that schools and governments should implement so that we can really bring global change to mental health, which is a really important part of the activism conversation. So, I'm really excited for you guys to listen to this one.

I hope you leave this feeling inspired and empowered on your journey of being a mental health advocate or at least feel more equipped to support others who are being vulnerable and speaking out about their own experiences. So, With that, let's dive in.

Sadie: Well, I'm so excited to have both of you guys here today. I was part of one of the Active Minds chapters at Penn and it's just such an incredible organization. I see the Zen Silence packing set up every year and it's just such a powerful community that you guys have built and so I'm so excited to have you on the podcast today.

Alison: Well, really appreciate that. It's a, it's an honor for us to be here and always really fun to talk with folks about what Active Minds has meant for them and to them and what Active Minds is doing out in the world. So, , just really happy to be able to, to have this conversation with you and with Lauren from our team.

Sadie: Yeah, okay. Well, to start, I would love to hear why you started Active Minds, a little bit of background there. I know you have a really powerful story, and so I'd love to touch on that, and then we'll of course touch in to how people can get involved with mental health advocacy, because I think so many people have this experience where they've gone through mental health challenges, they feel so compelled, or they know someone, and they feel so compelled to get involved, to speak out, to offer support, and and Unfortunately, it's not always that easy. Like there are ways that are really effective and amazing and inspiring when it comes to mental health advocacy. And sometimes when we talk about things that can be less effective and empowering for people. And so I think having specific ways that you can get involved and really be part of a community, which is one of the other amazing parts of mental health advocacy that sometimes gets missed is super important.

So I'm excited to dive into that. But to start. Can we hear a little bit about your own story and why you started ActiveMinds?

Alison: Sure. I'd be happy to share. , so the, the short of, , my really kind of personal and, life changing story is that I was a student at Penn actually also, , in my freshman year at Penn, I lost my brother.

Brian to suicide. , Brian himself had been a college student and, , he started struggling with his mental health in his freshman year of college, but didn't tell anybody until his senior year. , we come from a really supportive family. My mom is a clinical social worker. , we came from the environment where, , he had the support at home if it were something that he had felt comfortable talking to people about, but, but he didn't, , and hid his symptoms for the entirety of his life.

, and so I'm going to talk a little bit about my first college career, both from me and my mom, but also from his friends, , and the folks around him. And he ultimately went and got help from his school's counseling services, came home, took a voluntary leave of absence from his college, but, , ended up taking his life in March of my freshman year of college.

So that's what kind of got me into this world of, of understanding, learning, being thrown into mental health, mental illness, suicide, suicide prevention. , I happened to be taking an abnormal psychology class the semester that Brian died and so it was taking what I was learning in school and really applying it to home and, and, think the thing that really struck me the most was learning the age of onset of most mental health issues, learning the fact that suicide is the second leading cause of death for youth and young adults.

Finding all of that out only because my brother had taken his life and only because I was in an abnormal psychology class and, wondering why we weren't talking about it more openly so that people like Brian knew that they weren't alone, knew it wasn't their fault, and felt comfortable reaching out for help earlier and, and people like his friends who saw changes in him but didn't know what to say and wanted them to know what to say and how to support him and help him get into the, , the care that he needed.

And so, , I launched a student group, , at Penn, , in my junior year, and, , upon graduating, a year and a half later, I started a non profit in order to develop and support other chapters of that student group. , at other schools and, and really more than anything, , bring about kind of a generational shift in mental health and mobilize and engage youth and young adults as a whole, , to talk about mental health differently because I saw just how quickly , my generation, And people who are younger than me were, were wanting to talk about mental health.

We're globbing on to this idea of having a mental health group. And it just wasn't something that we had been taught about as we were growing up. And so it was going to create, , need for some change, , and some generational shift in mental health. And so, , that's how Active Minds was, was launched. , with the idea that we have the opportunity to mobilize, , the generation, the Active Minds generation.

to think and talk about mental health differently and, , to create a space where everybody gets the help they need as soon as they need it because we're talking about mental health every day and recognizing that, , we may not all have mental illness, but we all have mental health and so this is part of our everyday life and we have an opportunity to make sure that Policies are supportive of mental health, individuals know what to say to each other, and people feel comfortable talking about both their struggles and their triumphs and recognizing it's part of their everyday work.

Sadie: I want to talk about the, that phenomenon where people, we have really universal experiences when it comes to mental health. I think a lot of us can relate to that feeling of like, no one gets it, I'm so alone, I don't feel supported, I don't feel seen, and yet so many people are feeling that way at the same time.

We're just not talking about it, and I'm sure you guys have had so, so, so many people come to you and. Express that and explain that like I just didn't feel seen. I didn't feel heard. I didn't know how to articulate what I was going through , and I was wondering if we could speak a little bit to that experience potentially why people don't feel comfortable being vulnerable And I think that's something that when you haven't struggled with your mental health.

It's really confusing whether it's parents or peers or Friends, it's like why didn't they say anything? Why didn't they ask for help? I would have responded well So I was wondering if you guys had any thoughts there and why people Struggle to put words to those things or or hide and and put on this like different more edited version of themselves to the outside world, even when you know that you would have responded well or that you would have.

I've been there with open arms wanting to offer support and end validation.

Alison: Yeah. Lauren, do you want to take that? I want to introduce Lauren Takara, who is our VP of School Mental Health and would love for you to be able to take that, Lauren.

Lauren: Yeah. Happy to do that. Thanks for having us, Sadie. So I think you're right.

I think that, , you know, our, our health and wellness journey is, personal, right? So there's this layer of like, I don't want to burden somebody. I'm going through this myself. But I think one of the things that I want to point out is that this generation, I think, Allison has really been a trailblazer in this mental health movement.

Because when you know, Brian died and she started Active Minds, she was probably one of very, very few people, let alone undergraduate students that was really talking about mental health and really trying to like normalize that conversation and combat some of that stigma that you're talking about.

And so we've seen a huge shift in 20 years. So yes, there's still a layer of this. I don't want to burden people. And it's like, it's this personal, but on the outside of that, people are very interested in advocating for mental health as a movement, as a whole, right? So there's this like dilemma in some ways, like I want to advocate for it as a whole, but I don't want to say anything personally.

So, so I think a lot of our young adults are sort of experiencing that they really care about their peers. They really care about how mental health is valued and prioritized in their schools and in their communities, but they don't know what to do in that individual space. So one of the cool things that, , active mind.

, recently launched, we worked with Showtime and MTV, and we rolled out, , sort of like an everyday conversation tool that can really help, , provide youth and young adults the tool to have those individual conversations with their peers. And it's called AUSK. So it's A S K, and it's Acknowledged Support and Keep in Touch.

And so, , folks can go through a self guided sort of YouTube video. They're a series. , and it kind of gives them the step by step of really how to think about. , Asking people, you know, hey, how's it going and sort of validating what somebody else is sharing with them. You might not have all the answers and that's okay.

You don't need to have a clinical background to help somebody. You don't have to have a clinical background to have a conversation about mental health. Just like Allison said, we all have mental health like we have physical health, right? So this tool really helps you acknowledge that, hey, somebody might be struggling or you might be like, You're acting like yourself.

I just want to check in and see how are you doing? How are you doing? Oh, I hear you're having a bad day. Have you eaten today? Have you seen the sun? Have you gone outside for some fresh air? Like even those little pieces, right? Help. And if something is larger than that, that somebody is experiencing a mental health crisis, that is where the support comes in, right?

How can you support that person in, say, finding the tools and resources or other people to maybe help them if things are, are feeling. A lot stickier or harder for you to just navigate a general conversation level, right? And so being able to be there and support somebody through that, being able to say, Hey, I'd I'm not a counselor, but I know that our campus has a counseling center.

Let's go and see what they have and really advocating for getting an appointment. Or hey, have you called 988? You might just need to talk to somebody that has that clinical experience that I don't have, right? That support piece. , and then the last step is really keeping in touch. This is probably the most important, right?

In the sense that it's not just this one and done. And you don't have to keep in touch in sort of this robotic way. Hey, so you came to me to have this conversation. How are you doing? It's like, Hey, how's it going? How was that psychology test? Like, Hey, I saw that you are volunteering. , you know, at the local animal shelter, I saw from your Instagram.

How's that? That must be really a lot of fun, right? It's just these nuggets that you can sort of ensure that you're staying in touch with somebody that you are checking in and not this robotic way, but seeing sort of the whole person being there fully for them, it's not just like, Thanks for having the conversation.

I'm out of here. That, that consistent sort of checking in, Hey, let's grab a meal. That makes a huge difference. So we share those tools as very, very simple everyday ways to kind of ensure that we are staying in touch with people that we're checking in, in a way, because. Our world is our world right now, and a lot of our students are navigating not only school things, but just life in general.

And so, how can we ensure that we are genuinely and intentionally connecting with people that, in a way that matters, right? , and the, the smallest conversation can make the world of difference to somebody.

Sadie: A hundred percent. And I also think, , Allison, what you mentioned about your brother about, like, having this facade that you put on for friends and family and school and all of that, I r I remember that experience, and I also remember that it was like a very precariously put together facade, and I think if I'd actually been asked, like, how are you doing or tried to be vulnerable about that, it would have just been emotions and, , not something that would have been able to to stay established, but I also remember that Because I was really struggling and really emotional about my mental health, I would present fine for small questions, like, How is your week going?

How did the test go? Like, those little freebies that people ask you, like, How are you doing today? And then all the way up to, like, How is your mental health? How are you doing? How do you feel about yourself? How do you feel about your life? And so, If you're listening and you're like, that's me, I'm completely putting up this facade where I'm letting no one in and someone else how my day is and I'm saying great, but I'm really struggling on the inside.

I'm not even remotely having those vulnerable conversations being like I'm not doing well and I might need support. Starting at those smaller ones, like, how was your day today? I'd be like, you know what? It was really overwhelming and I missed my alarm and I have this crazy test coming up and having that vulnerability about those smaller things that feels more manageable can be helpful in kind of doing a little exposure therapy up to that point.

big vulnerability of like, I, I'm not okay and I think I need support because, unfortunately, you're building that skill set and you're building that, , routine and pattern of just not being vulnerable and not asking for help and not sitting with how you're feeling and suppressing that, which can be even more painful as well.

Alison: Yeah, I think it's so right, Sadie, and I think about it often because, you know, we'll wake up in the morning with our throat hurting and you'll tell somebody, oh, my throat hurts, or like, I didn't sleep well last night, right? Like, that rules off our tongue. in a way that is totally appropriate because we're vocalizing our struggle.

We're saying, okay, this might be a tough day or I got to watch myself. We, for whatever reason, feel like we need to wait until we have hit rock bottom before we say that about our mental health. And so next time you're thinking that next time you're having that little struggle, I so wholeheartedly agree with what you said, Sadie, actually answering the question when somebody says, how are you?

It can open up for you the ability to be vulnerable in microdoses, which can then build up on each other. And you'll find that almost everybody around you is also struggling in some other way. And so you're also opening up the conversation for them to say the same thing and then everybody wins, right?

Like you've shared, they've shared. You don't feel alone because so much of this feels alone. So much of this feels like it's our fault that we're the only ones, that everybody else has all their stuff together, but it's because we all are keeping up this facade. And what's so interesting about, , how we talk about mental health, as Lauren was saying earlier, , there's actually a lot more conversation about mental health going on.

And, and research is showing that people are saying, no, I wouldn't judge somebody who tells me they have a mental health disorder. I wouldn't judge somebody who tells me that they're going to therapy. But I judge myself. And so if you think about it in that way, nobody is judging you and nobody would judge you if you shared what you're going through, the most judgment that's happening is yourself to yourself.

And so if you give yourself a little bit of permission to say, I know that I have people in my life who love me and care about me, and this is the whole of me, , that gives you the opportunity to be your whole self and to get the support not only that you need, but you deserve, right? You deserve support when you're struggling in the same way that you do if you didn't sleep well in the same way, if your throat is hurting, , and, and just recognize that that's what it means to take care of your mental health.

Yes, it. Cucumbers on your eyes. Yes, it's massive distress activities. If that's something that helps you during a stressful time, but sometimes it's as simple as. I didn't have a good night or I'm not having a good day. That is also self-care. That is also taking care of your mental health and in many ways is what we need in order to be able to be the, the totality of our vulnerability, , to get the support that we really deserve.

Sadie: Alison, I'm curious, when you were at Penn, if Penn faced was a thing because whenever we have a Penn grad on the podcast, I have to ask because it's such a hot topic. I think that's what most mental health conversations revolve around at Penn and . There was a study, I'm doing quotations, because it was not an actual study, but you see this floating around in the Penn community, that like, Penn is the most depressed university, and the students are more depressed than any other college, , and I've, I've heard a lot of different schools of thought.

Subjectively, I haven't found that to be the case, and I'm also curious what your thoughts are there, because it really exemplifies what you spoke about at the beginning with your brother, where it's like, you're putting on this facade that everything's okay, and everyone's doing it, and no one's talking about this internal struggle, , and it's really interesting for a community to, embrace and accept that, like, that's what we're all doing, and that's what's happening, and it's ineffective, but we're not really shifting anything about it, so I was wondering if that was a thing when you were there, and if you had thoughts.

Alison: Yeah, so, , I was a Penn before the term Penn face was a thing, like that's how old I am, I would say, and also, absolutely, but I would say that it's not, it wasn't, and continues to not be unique to Penn, and this is one of the things that I've really come to understand and appreciate. My brother was at a school that was similar to Penn, and so I could equate his experience and my experience and say, well, you know, we're at similar types of school, then I can see this is happening.

Yeah. Yeah. And this is happening at schools that are not penned, right? And, and we are all facing different stressors. For some folks, they are non traditional students who have families and also in school. For some folks, they are working a full time job and also in school. For some folks, they are, , you know, a student athlete or in Greek life and also dealing with every, what I have seen over the years in doing this work is that everyone is facing stresses and stressors in their own ways.

, in ways that we could never understand if we're not them, , and it's all relevant and it all matters. And so, yes, PenFace existed. Though the term wasn't even known yet, it hadn't been coined yet, but it existed, and that was what I was trying to break through, was I wanted my peers to know you don't have to be perfect, and actually, the vast majority of the people here are struggling, and you're not alone if you are not having the time of your life right now, , and if we can break that open and we can have this everyday conversation about mental health, it opens up this idea that Oh, I can struggle and also be successful, right?

That was the message that my brother had never gotten. In his mind, once he got his diagnosis of his mental health disorder, to him that was a life sentence. He could never be the, you know, Dean's List graduate superstar person that he had seen himself being because he had this mental health disorder.

And what he needed was a role model to say, yes, I also have schizoaffective disorder I've also struggled with depression. And I'm going to graduate and I'm going to be a really successful at whatever I want to be those messages didn't get out there and I think what we see often in environment like Penn is this idea of perfect or nothing.

And the whole idea of active minds of mobilizing around mental health is to say, you are still somebody, even when you struggle with your mental health because we all struggle with our mental health we'll just don't all talk about it. And these struggles happen across the board. Socioeconomic status across demographics, across gender identity, , with different groups of people, , who research is showing, , are impacted even more than others.

But it's not just one type of school and it's not just one type of student, , who struggles with their mental health. , and that, that's what this is about is whatever it is, it is impacting you. Let's talk about it and let's get you whatever the support that you need in that moment in order to be able to be that successful person that you desire to be for yourself and to be able to thrive and that looks different for everybody.

Sadie: Yeah, I think that was one of my biggest realizations going home the first couple of times. It's like, everyone is having really similar experiences. Everyone is, missing home. Everyone is trying to build that new friend group and meet new people, and it's overwhelming and stressful. Everyone's stressed about their midterm coming up.

Everyone's, like, slightly sleep deprived, unfortunately. Like, all of those are the same. And maybe there's, some big things, like, m Maybe your school is a big sports school and a lot of your social interactions revolve around that. Maybe you're in Greek life. Maybe you're not. there's those types of things, but generally the subjective experience is really similar across the board, which is very important to remember.

I think also what you mentioned is so interesting. We have such a gap between psychology research and what we know about mental health and then what the general population is actually aware of and internalizes, and the fact that we know the majority of adults will be diagnosed with a mental illness at some point in their life, not just that they have mental health or that they'll struggle, but they'll be diagnosed, and that's believed to be an underestimation.

So if you're not diagnosed or you're not struggling, you're, you're the minority. you're not in that majority of people that at some point have that, that tough spot or have this thing that they're dealing with in their day to day lives and most people just aren't aware of that and they still internalize it like you're saying that like, this is gonna affect the trajectory of my life and this is, , gonna have a really big impact on, my future.

I. want to talk about some of these, like, I don't know if warning signs would be the right term, but I think to implement the ASK framework, it's really important to be aware of the People acting different and what to keep an eye out for I think especially for parents who have never had a teen before and they're like, what is happening?

I don't know what to look for. And I think also as a teen and as a young adult, when you've never had friends struggle before, you don't know what to look for. It's very confusing and overwhelming. And you're like, are they just in a, a different period of time? maybe their personality is a little bit different or is something actually wrong.

So I'd love to get your guys thoughts on what people can be aware of and when they then should go and implement the ASK framework. And if they're younger, if they're in middle school or high school, potentially loop in a trusted adult.

Lauren: Yeah, that's a really great question. Middle school is hard already, right?

and so you add in just like what middle school is, Puberty, right? It's just, it's weird. It's wonderful. It's awkward. It's fun. It's all those things. Right. And so from like a developmental side of, of things, we go through a lot at that age and, , we're trying to figure ourselves out. And was recently talking to a parent who sort of asked the same question and.

, you know, I think for, for parents and caregivers is you can use Oscar's an everyday tool. You don't have to use that. Just when you see something happening or you kind of think something is happening, you can use those same steps just to check in. So kind of like how Alison said, when somebody asks you how you are, answer how you are.

We have to learn how to be honest in answering that question. Because I think as a society, we've gotten away from that, right? And so for parents and caregivers, it is that checking in, like, Hey, how's it going? Hey, I saw that you just chucked your school bag down at the door and didn't open it. Did you have any homework?

You know, like, is there anything in there? Do you go to school? What's happening? And, and, and I get it. There is this dynamic between parents and children. And especially when you are of that age, you're like, Oh, stop bothering me. But I think for parents and caregivers, it's like not to stop. Right. To continue.

And maybe you learn how to ask the questions a different way. And how to check in different ways, but you know, it's like, if you did just chuck the backpack at the back door and then just take off, right. Okay, what? There's more to this, giving them a minute to kind of like, you know, collect themselves and then going up to them a little bit later and be like, Hey, I just, you know, kind of chuck that a little hard, you know, like, how was your day?

Did you have lunch? who did you sit with? And, and being able to ask those kinds of questions to kind of unpack Not in a sneaky way, but in a different way that doesn't just be like what's going on, right? That's the thing that I think you have to do. , and then you have to keep that going you you have to consistently do that So again, it's just not this one and done and I think for parents and care groups they do this But it does get maybe a little more challenging As their children grow up, because they are far more independent, they're leaning on their peer groups a lot more, and I think that's where, having an Active Minds chapter really helps sort of also come at it from a different level, because you have that peer to peer opportunity where you can, have a, a student group that you are part of that you are talking about mental health and, and really thinking about, like, what are the warning signs, you know, like, okay, hey, , Allison stopped coming to the Active Minds chapter meeting on a consistent basis.

Maybe I should call Allison and see what's, what's going on. Right. You know, it's just paying attention to like these little cues that somebody is starting to just sort of slowly withdraw. Right. So it's not showing up to an Active Minds chapter meeting, not doing their homework on a consistent basis or opening up their backpack when they come home, you know, cause there's homework, right?

There's always some sort of homework, but it's like paying attention to those little pieces. you talk about sleep, right? , we also know that you need sleep to grow, As teenagers, you need sleep. So it's, it's, understanding like teenagers need a lot of sleep to grow, but where is the too much sleep coming in to play?

And like, how do we check in on that? So I think you always have to sort of be aware that you have to like, Ebb and flow. You have to move through and not feel so rigid when you're asking the questions when you're just, checking in, right? It's paying attention to some of those everyday behaviors that are, just small indicators that could increase into something larger and you want to be able to pay attention to them before they get into that larger piece.

, so I think that's probably the advice that I would give most folks and, , that doesn't feel. Too hard to like really conceptualize and utilize on the day to day. , so hopefully that feels manageable for most folks and, and we've gotten feedback that it does, right? Like that consistency and, , you know, lighten it up, like, Bring in humor, go do something, you don't have to feel so robotic and rigid just to check in, , and to pay attention.

, and I especially think that, it is a lot easier to like disclose things to your peers than it is to your family. I think it's just. our nature, right? Because it just feels like we're not burdening our families at that degree. And so it's a lot easier. So as friends, we do take a lot of that on our shoulders.

And that could impact what we're also going through. So it's also being able to ensure that you're available for folks, but then you're also taking care of yourself because Sometimes that can be very overwhelming as well. And that could impact your own mental health. If you're the one that everybody comes to and like, Oh, Lauren, you're so strong.

You're the strong friend. You hear all this. Okay, great. But can you check in on me every once in a while? Cause yeah, it is a lot. Right. So also I think being aware of like who in your friend group do you go to and also checking on that person on a consistent basis, because. , it, it's a two way street for sure.

Sadie: You mentioned chapter meetings. If people don't have an Active Minds chapter at their school and they'd like to learn a little bit more, can you guys give us kind of an overview of what it looks like to get involved and also opportunities if there isn't a local chapter, all the things related to advocacy and Active Minds specifically?

Lauren: Yeah. Yeah. So, . The chapters are what we call, , our student led mental health groups, and that's what Allison really started when she was at Penn, and then really how she started Active Minds. And so, , We have about 600 Active Minds chapters across the country, and they're student led mental health clubs, essentially.

And all you need is at least three students and an advisor to start, , the chapter. , that really follows a lot of, , high school and, , college, , club, , requirements if you want to start a student led club. student club in your school, you need to register at your school. So you need to ensure that the chapter is an officially recognized student organization.

And then you just fill out a registration form, , on the active minds webpage. And, , our chapters team will send you sort of an onboarding kit. , for high schools, we have a pre, student facilitated curriculum that they can use as their program guide. So instead of being like, Hey, we just started this club.

Now what do we do? We kind of this, this discussion guide, , that students can use, , that's peer to peer. They have, , some topic areas like social media and mental health. , and then it's all discussion based where they can use that, , as their chapter meeting. , and then, you know, they can create, , They can bring in speakers, active minds has a number of speakers that actually share their own mental health stories.

, so you can bring in an active mind speaker as part of your chapter work, but it's really easy to start. So, , there is a list of all of the chapters on our webpage. So if you're not sure if your school has one or not, you can check that out. So you can kind of see, Oh, well, I didn't know that Penn had a chapter.

Great. Then you can kind of see, , find out where their meetings are. But if you don't have a chapter, it's really easy to start. And then you're part of our network. And so, , once you register, , we host, , sort of workshops, and we have a lot of resources for our chapter members and our leaders. , we have a newsletter that we send out to all of our students in our network, and it's every other week.

through that newsletter, we're always highlighting new resources or, or opportunities to get involved in active minds and beyond. Right? It's not just about like what active minds is doing, but in the field of mental health, we partner with a number of organizations across the country at the national level and at the state level.

So say you're really are, are interested in, say, telling your story and advocating for state policy, we can probably connect you with a lot of those state policy, , leaders who are trying to affect change at the local level where you could go and testify or, or tell your story to some, , elected official, , so those are the types of things that our chapters do. So it's not only about this education and awareness, but also this advocacy piece and wanting to really change policies or advocate for resources or funding even that go chapters can actually do a little bit more at your school campus.

Sadie: I want to touch on policy and schools. What are you guys hoping to see in the next like 5, 10, 20 years as far as shifts in policy and how we approach mental health in middle schools, high schools, college, et cetera? What are you guys working towards? It's a great question.

Lauren: I think the, the first thing I always think about is, , money.

So we need a lot more money. I mean, I think just in health care in general, you know, , access to mental health care. , there's still a lot of barriers to somebody accessing care for themselves, right? And so I think a little bit of that is, , we need to do a better job of educating people about what is out there already and how they actually access the health care system because the health care system is scary.

It's big. It's complicated. Right, so I think there's an education piece that we need to be part of, but then from, like, the policy and financial side of things, it, how do we actually develop a pipeline on, black, indigenous and people of color therapists that actually are going into the mental health workforce, right?

Because we know that a lot of our, , , communities of color, when they don't see themselves represented in the health care system. That adds a layer of, hesitancy and, and, , distrust, right? And so having more of an opportunity to get folks into the field of mental health from a clinical standpoint, I think, is one thing.

, and then I think, With the funding also comes like what kinds of programs can schools actually tap into, you know, it's great that you can have an active minds chapter, but how is your school funded? Is the funding actually supporting increasing the counseling center or increasing the resources around mental health?

Because again, you don't always have to think about mental health from the clinical side of things, but it's just You know, from a school culture side of things, where is that support? So I think those are the first two things that I really think about and where we really need to head over the next five years.

, and I think we're starting to incrementally see some of that shift. I think the white house, , and the Biden administration has put a lot of effort and funding into mental health, which has been lovely, which is great. It's never enough, right? So like we constantly have to be advocating for more, but it's a huge, huge step in the right direction.

Allison, what would you add?

Alison: Yeah, I think what you've said, Lauren, is great. And I think one of the things that's been really interesting for me to see and to learn is, When we think about mental health, and especially when we think about policy change, folks often just think about clinical care. We need to increase the number of counselors, and that is critically important.

We need to increase, we need to diversify, we need to make sure counselors are available to folks. in the modality that they are able to reach them. So not everybody can drive to a therapist. Not everybody has insurance to cover a major therapy appointment. So what are the ways that people can access care?

But also, if we only think of it in terms of the treating those who have either hit rock bottom because we know folks aren't getting help until too late, then we are missing a whole opportunity to kind of take this public health approach to mental health. And those are the pieces that , as Lauren was saying that I think is so important, the data shows that when a youth or young adult feels as though the environment around them cares about their mental health, so if their school cares about their mental health, their college does, whatever it may be, they are actually more likely to reach out for help, they are more likely to have positive mental health, and so as we look at policy changes, we need to continue to look at policy change As it relates to a public health approach to mental health and not just a clinical intervention, , treatment for people with severe mental illness.

And, and again, I, you know, as somebody whose brother had severe mental illness, I, I, hear and I feel it deeply. And also, there were three or four years where he could have been getting a different level of support. Before we got to that point, and we are going to reduce the burden on our clinical care.

We are going to reduce the burden on our counseling centers if we can continue to take this public health approach. So everything from, you know, there was the introduction of 988 last year, which is a public health approach. shift in how we used to have to think about a 10 digit number to call a mental health number.

No, now it's just 988, just like you call 911, because you know what? Your mental health is just as important as your physical health and safety, and we're going to make this number just as easy to remember. So now with the introduction of 988, let's make sure the 988 is printed on the back of student ID cards alongside your student ID card.

The blue light phone number and other crisis, you know, the, the police, because you know what, at a school, your mental health matters just as much as your physical health and your safety does. , what other kind of public health approaches to mental health? Where is this programming? Where are we ensuring that there is mental health programming in health education classes?

Where are we ensuring that there's mental health in, , first year orientation in college? Where are we ensuring that there's a mental health? , parity within the workplace. So new employees, young employees, understand where to go to get mental health support in addition to, , how to, you know, get support for their physical health.

So really looking at, , the policies that bring mental health to the same level, bring parity to mental health, the same level of health support. , and safety issues, I think, is a really key, important part, , of this conversation that , we can and will be pursuing over the next few years.

Lauren: Can I add something?

Yeah. I think the other piece to that, I think, Allison, you're spot on, but the other piece to that is, how did mental health change your life? being embedded in other policy issues as well. So when you think about gun control, we know that this generation of students has all been affected by gun violence, right?

So when we think about gun control, when we think about climate change, right? How is mental health also being woven into that narrative as well? Because we know that, like, all of those things really affect our mental health. So I think it's yes, it needs to be, like, part of a standalone policy priority, but there are other policy priorities where mental health can actually be embedded into that framework as well, and I think that's the piece that is sometimes missing, that we talk about it in these separate boxes, , where actually it's very intersectional in some ways, right, and we can't talk about gun control without talking about all the other layers to that, and mental health is a big piece of that.

Sadie: I love that. So, so, so important. If people want to learn more about ActiveMinds and follow along with the work you guys are doing, where can they do that?

Lauren: Yeah, so they can go on to ActiveMinds. org. That is our web page. , you can sign up for our newsletter. Even if you don't have an ActiveMinds chapter or you haven't started, , working with us or participating in our program, anybody can sign up for our newsletters.

That's probably the first place. As well as following us on all the social media, , because our newsletters, like I said, are always, , updated and, , highlighting new ways to, , join us and be part of our programs. So that's probably the first place to start. And then our programs are all listed there, so you can actually kind of dig in and see what our programs are.

Full menu of offerings are and then if you have particular questions, , say about chapters, you can actually fill out an inquiry form, and then, you know, connect with our team and we'd be happy to, to connect with you and kind of do a deeper dive as needed.

Sadie: Incredible.

Well, thank you guys so, so much for this conversation. I know so many people are going to be so impacted by it and really motivated to get involved. So thank you guys for taking the time. Thanks for having us.

Alison: Thanks for having us.

Sadie: Thank you so much for listening to this week's episode of she persisted. If you enjoyed, make sure to share with a friend or family member, it really helps out the podcast. And if you haven't already leave a review on apple podcasts or Spotify, you can also make sure to follow along at actually persisted podcast on both Instagram and Tik TOK, and check out all the bonus resources, content and information on my website.

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